Ian Bicking: the old part of his blog

Re: Turbogearsandpylons comment 000

Certainly a SFSB (Stateful Session Bean) isn't too hard of an idea to implement by just shoving it in a session myself. Not too scalable, and real EJB containers are a lot smarter about state replication than that, but it would work. But to wax flippant a bit, the entire framework isn't something I couldn't reimplement by myself too once I understand how it works. Yes, some pieces are complicated, and hard to get right, and that's precisely why frameworks are there to make them easy to _use_ so that the end user doesn't have to reinvent it in a buggy way that won't interoperate with anything else.

Viewstate is another of those "evil" things everyone loves to hate about ASP.NET and JSF, but that no one's really come up with a satisfactory alternative for (it's something you can store server-side too, which removes most objections to the hideous clutter it adds to the client side html).

I guess I'm just bemoaning the glut of classic MVC frameworks and the lack of anything else like a Prado or Seam -- let alone a Seaside.

Comment on Turbogearsandpylons comment 000
by Chuck Adams

Comments:

Viewstate is another of those "evil" things everyone loves to hate about ASP.NET and JSF, but that no one's really come up with a satisfactory alternative for (it's something you can store server-side too, which removes most objections to the hideous clutter it adds to the client side html).

Maris Fogels has just started playing around with a ViewState helper for Pylons:

http://pylonshq.com/project/pylonshq/wiki/ViewState

# Philip Jenvey