Ian Bicking: the old part of his blog

Re: Review: Beyond Java

As an aside, and as a Python developer: you can keep your dumb jobs, you can keep your proprietary community, you can keep your enterprise, because please don't come bother us with your boring enterprisey problems)

Mmmmm. Flamebait. Yummy.

The bit about "proprietary community" is unfair. Java has a large, active open source community around it and Sun is slowly openning up the core language too. The rest of it is arguable.

Comment on Review: Beyond Java
by Alan Green


Yeah, flamey I'll admit. However, I'm not talking about Java developers particularly; I didn't really mean to say anything against Java. Just because boring jobs call for things like Java doesn't mean Java is necessarily a bad language. And honestly, someone has to do those jobs and build those systems. Using exciting technology to build boring products eventually becomes old, and in an open source community it doesn't just become old for the people building the systems, but the boring trickles out into the rest of the community. No fun. Proprietary development tends to support boring programming jobs better than open source. Some people might like to get something for nothing from the F/OSS community, but that doesn't always work.

I guess I really was saying: it doesn't always work, and I personally have no incentive to make it work or offer ideas on how to make it work.

# Ian Bicking

Well, Ian, I really admire your stuff, and appreciate your dedication to Python as a web development language. However, if the job isn't in Detroit, and isn't a payroll system , the simple fact that the job description may include "Python" experience can have exactly the effect you described earlier, of attracting coders. Even if it is about "boring enterprisey problems." In other words, it seems to me that the opportunity to address SOA, ESB, etc. with Python opens the door to building clean, lightweight, flexible, extensible, maintainable, and evolvable tools. Once you get that, the boring part is much less of an issue, IMHO.

Another point that you might consider. Maybe some folks don't get bored so easily, and really enjoy the ongoing challenge of keeping a system running with clean, efficient code, while avoiding bloat, one-offs, etc. I guess what I'm saying is that I think garden variety coders deserve the chance to use Python too!

# Jerry Spicklemire